#FreeSteveNash: ESPN’s big guns weigh in

Posted by on February 5th, 3:00 pm

As the Phoenix Suns seemed destined to spend this season in the NBA no-man’s land of “not good enough to make the playoffs and not bad enough to contend for the No. 1 pick,” the #FreeSteveNash movement got some national attention this week. Prominent NBA analysts such as ESPN’s John Hollinger and Grantland’s Bill Simmons weighed in with their thoughts on Captain’s Canada’s future with the Suns and some potential trades for Phoenix to pursue. Let’s examine these proposed trades and evaluate them on both feasibility and potential benefit for the Suns.

Editor’s Note: If you as a Suns fan are squeamish or are prone to hysterics at the thought of Steve Nash leaving the desert, the following trades may prove too much for you, so you may want to save yourself the mental pain and anguish and just look away.

On Tuesday, John Hollinger wrote in his PER Diem about a Nash-to-Portland deal. Here’s the link to the deal on ESPN’s NBA Trade Machine. The crux of the trade is Phoenix receiving Ray Felton, two young prospects, and a pick in exchange for Steve Nash. Hollinger puts this trade forth despite the fact that based on the involved players’ current PER numbers, this trade would drop Phoenix’s projected wins by 10 games. This is partly due to the fact that neither Nolan Smith nor Elliot Williams have played enough to have PER data.

There is no reason to think that a deal such as this one wouldn’t happen outside of both Nash and the Suns front office’s vehement denials of the possibility of a trade. For the purposes of the column, we’ll ignore that. As the Suns sink deeper and deeper into irrelevancy and mediocrity, it’s entirely possible both sides might relax their view on a trade.

The deal makes sense for Portland as Felton’s contract is expiring just like Nash’s. So in essence, the Blazers would be renting with the possibility of re-signing Steve Nash for the price of two prospects and a pick. For the Suns, the prospects will inject some youth into an aging roster. The pick, which will likely be in the 18-24 range, will still be a valuable asset in a draft this deep. In the offseason, the Suns could stand pat with their two picks and two prospects to start a serious youth movement or package some combination of them to move up into the top five or trade for a solid veteran.

In his NBA Season Review: 20 Questions, Bill Simmons also mentioned the possibility of a Nash-to-Portland deal. His version, however, had the Suns receiving Nic Batum in place of the guard prospects. Batum, a favorite of VotS overlord Michael Schwartz, was not extended by the Trail Blazers before the deadline, possibly indicating that Portland is willing to part with him for the right price.

By Hollinger’s prediction this version of the trade would only cost the Suns one predicted win, and thus seems far more beneficial to the franchise (especially when you consider that Felton and Batum’s PER numbers undoubtedly go up in Phoenix as each would play a bigger role than they currently do in Portland.)  In Felton, the Suns would get a point guard who isn’t awful and was extremely productive under Mike D’Antoni last year in New York. In Batum, the Suns get a player who is young, energetic, and efficient, three things Phoenix sorely needs right now. Batum is also a restricted free agent, so acquiring him now would put the Suns in prime position to sign him to a longer deal as Phoenix could match any offer made for him in the offseason.

Whether or not Portland would do this deal depends on the likelihood of Nash re-signing with the Trail Blazers in the offseason. Because he was extended two years ago, Nash’s current contract isn’t eligible to be extended again as outlined in this piece by Mark Stein. Thus Portland would have to hope that another trip to playoffs is enough to entice Nash to give the Blazers his remaining years.

Simmons also proposed a possible deal with Indiana. The deal, outlined here, would swap Nash for Darren Collison and a 2012 No. 1 pick. This pick would probably be slightly worse than Portland’s as Indiana’s schedule is Eastern Conference heavy, but again in a deep draft any pick can help.

For Phoenix, this trade would give them a young, still-developing point guard to replace Nash. Collison is considered to be one of the fastest players in the NBA and has shown flashes of brilliance in his short career, particularly in place of an injured Chris Paul when both were still in New Orleans. Nash is definitely the superior point guard, but Collison with his speed could mature into a strong distributor and team leader under the right tutelage .

Whether or not Indiana would pull the trigger on this deal would again depend on its ability to re-sign Nash in the offseason. Also, the Pacers’ willingness to trade for Nash would definitely depend on how close they believe they are to title contention. It makes little sense for Indiana to trade a young asset who should continue to improve if the Pacers’ ceiling is anything less than a Finals appearance with the addition of Steve Nash.

Bill Simmons posed the question, “Why hasn’t #freestevenash evolved into a social media campaign along the lines of #occupywallstreet?” The answer, as always, is Nash’s fierce loyalty to his teammates and the Suns’ franchise.

“… I just feel that I owe it to my teammates to stay committed to them. I feel that I owe it to the fans and the organization to fight,” Nash said in an interview with ESPN’s Marc Stein. Fight as he may, what happens if the Suns continue to toil in no-man’s land? Could the situation arise where the best thing for the fans and the organization is to move Nash and get some pieces to build around in return? Will Nash and the Suns’ management see the writing on the wall before the March 15 deadline? There is no way to know. For now the “Phoenix Revolution” will remain untelevised.

But it will be on Twitter. #FreeSteveNash

Ryan Weisert

Ryan Weisert is a staff writer for ValleyoftheSuns. You can also find him at his sports and pop culture blog Spectavius.com.

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Tags: Indiana Pacers · Phoenix Suns · Phoenix Suns Analysis · Portland Trail Blazers · Steve Nash · Trades

63 responses so far ↓

  • 1 shazam // Feb 5, 2012 at 4:44 pm

    the ONLY reason nash stays in phoenix is because he wants to be around his kids….those rich kids of his are holding phx. hostage from re-building

  • 2 And1 // Feb 5, 2012 at 5:22 pm

    @Shazam

    You’re an idiot thinking that rebuilding starts with trading Nash. Do you know how hard it is these days to find a perfect guard like Nash? If there is any rebuilding going to happen, it starts with all the players with the exception of Gortat & Dudley.

    You don’t know what you’re asking for in trading Nash. If you thinking losing Amare was bad, losing Nash would be the worst.

  • 3 Tony // Feb 5, 2012 at 5:39 pm

    Shazam,

    with all due respect, I have to completely disagree with you on this one.

    While I’m sure his kids obviously have something to do with wanting to stay in Phoenix, there are also many other factors. For instance, at his age, unless he is guaranteed to go to the Knicks, why would he want to learn a new offense under a coach he’s never played for? He only has probably two more years left in the NBA, so why shouldn’t he enjoy it?

    Furthermore, and I understand this, for Nash it might be better to lose on a team where he’s an integral component than to win on a team while being of lesser importance.

    Either way, the Suns are going to be terrible for at least another three to four seasons regardless of what Nash does. If the Three Stooges try to trade him now, they are not going to be able to get much value in return anyway. The time to have traded Nash was last season when the Suns front office would have some leverage in getting good assets in return for Nash. But now, teams know he’s a free agent at the end of the season, so why would they expend valuable assets for him at this point?

    If the dummies in the Suns front office manage to sign some pretty good players this off-season and resign Nash for another year, the Suns might do some damage. He might even help attract some of the more talented free agents. We have to remember that although it’s necessary to clear cap space to sign the best players, a team looking to sign those level of players need to already have some relevance in the NBA. Right now, the only thing relevant about the Suns is Nash.

  • 4 shazam // Feb 5, 2012 at 5:50 pm

    yes i do know what im asking for with trading nash…im asking for us to be losers for 3 years …real stinkers so that we have a shot at good draft picks…and scott im sure there are other reasons nash wants to stay here….but winning basketball games isnt one of them…i would like players that prioritize winning differently and above personal comfort etc….heres what the suns used to look like http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2UF1ggq0vd4

  • 5 shazam // Feb 5, 2012 at 6:08 pm

    @ tony…with all due respect w/ nash we win a few extra games hurting our lottery picks ….”If the dummies in the Suns front office manage to sign some pretty good players this off-season”…the problem w/ this is those dummies in the dront office have ruined us as a franchise destination…the good free agents wont come here…its not all about the money these days

  • 6 And1 // Feb 5, 2012 at 6:29 pm

    @Shazam

    So you want to end up like the Wolves, Kings, Wizards, or the other lower teams who has been doing that for years, and still have gotten nowhere? with the exception of Clippers.

    It’s risky and it would completely change the franchise’s makeup as a contending team every season to a team trying to build & build & build. Remember that the Suns franchise is a winning team without a ring.

    And even if you get the likes of Amare, Blake Griffin, etc… the most important position in the NBA is a point guard. I don’t have to point fingers at the Knicks do I? I mean, they are so talented but lacks a point guard. That’s how important a point guard is. And see how Nash is making this team beat with his mediocre teammates of his?

    Trading Nash is a nail in the coffin for the Suns for sure. And I don’t want to have to end up watching the Suns rebuild again like when they had Stephon running the show in Phoenix. Sure the Suns had Amare, Joe Johnson, Barbosa, Marion, but see what happens when Nash ran the show instead of Stephon? Big difference. Period!

  • 7 Zak // Feb 5, 2012 at 6:46 pm

    I have to agree with Tony. I doubt that a championship ring on a team where he was only a role player would mean much to Steve Nash. I believe that MOST of the Phoenix fans love him and don’t want him to be traded. Most of the fans are loyal to him and he’s loyal to his fans.

    If all you want to do is rant about how the Suns should be trying to loose more games, shazam… PLEASE just put ALL you opinions in ONE post and stop repeating yourself endlessly.

  • 8 steve // Feb 5, 2012 at 7:02 pm

    I’m in total disagreement that losing games is the way to build a winner. I understand the rhetoric, but I don’t agree. I think stability is the sign of a good franchise over tanking and hoping for the best. Things in the NBA can turn around with just one player. It’s a star-centric league. So, we aren’t guaranteed at least three years of being terrible. We can be good next year with the addition of a star. We could also be bad for 10 years or more if we can’t find that star. And also high draft picks aren’t guaranteed to result in great players. Anyway, it’s super bowl time again.

  • 9 Scott // Feb 5, 2012 at 7:07 pm

    Oh, Hollinger is such a homer! He wants Nash for his own team (the Blazers) and for peanuts at that. No one should take that trade seriously.

    Bill Simmons would like to trade Nash for another wing. I can imagine the chicken Bill Simmons would build: no head, but plenty of wings. Simmons is best known for his sports comedy; don’t listen to his trade ideas.

    And why should anyone think Nash is better off in Portland, under Nate McMillan, anyway? Because they won a championship once in the dim dark mists of time? Nash is not a McMillan-style player, he’s not the piece they need to contend, and furthermore, the Blazers are not a better run team than the Suns. They followed the infamous pick of Bowie over Jordan with the pick of Oden over Durant, showing they have learned nothing from one of the most highly publicized basketball stories ever; they fired their only good GM; they gave away a young Jermaine O’Neal just before he became a repeat all-star; and for years they ran the notorious “jail Blazers.” About the only positive for Nash being in Portland is he’d be close to his native soil. Which would be ideal if he was a vampire. :p

    As for the Indiana trade … I don’t see Nash to Indiana working at all. Why would Nash go there? Why would he stay there?

    If nothing materializes with NYC or possibly Dallas, Nash will stay with the Suns. His choices are all based on loyalty: to D’Antoni and a city he loves, to Dirk and the fans he used to play for, or to the Suns, where he became a 2x MVP and future Hall of Famer … if they’ll re-sign him.

    So unless something shifts, Nash will be in Phoenix for at least another year or two. Next year’s Suns FA money is going to Nash, and probably Hill, and probably Redd. And maybe even some to Lopez, if he and Gentry can have a successful meeting of the minds.

    There will be pressure on the Suns to make good picks in this year’s draft, as there should be each year.

    As for the Blazers … their likely plan, if they can’t work out a favorable trade with someone, is to stick with what they’ve got, let Felton go, and re-sign Batum. If they can’t get another quality PG (a likely target is Chauncey Billups), they’ll run with Smith and Williams.

  • 10 shazam // Feb 5, 2012 at 7:18 pm

    the suns are not going to get that 1 player unless its in the draft….and ill take “So you want to end up like the Wolves, Kings, Wizards, Clippers.”…over what we have now?…PLEASE YES YES YES…@ steve a sign of a good franchise is winning (period)…detroit etc. werent stable when they won it all @ and 1 “Sure the Suns had Amare, Joe Johnson, Barbosa, Marion” …how did they get those players?…you called me an idiot in an earlier comment…bwahahahahaha

  • 11 shazam // Feb 5, 2012 at 7:37 pm

    if youre a homer who has gotten used to never winning it all or settles for mediocrity or doesnt think the draft is the way to go then dont read this.. it will only make you face a reality youre unable to handle ..hell some are in such denial they even resort to second grader name calling haha

  • 12 And1 // Feb 5, 2012 at 8:25 pm

    @Shazam

    I guess you didn’t understand me. I said we have Amare, Marion, Joe Johnson, etc…yet we sucked until we had Nash running the show. In other words, point guards are really important. So no I don’t want to be the Wolves, Kings, etc… As you can see, with all the great draft picks they have, they still ain’t good. And like what Steve mentioned, drafts don’t give you championship. Most great draft players are traded anyways like Lebron James.

    Championship teams are built with a face, and trade assets. Nash is the face, now he just needs the perfect role players who plays to win each and every game.

  • 13 shazam // Feb 5, 2012 at 8:57 pm

    @zak im putting a positive realistic spin to losing (by the way thats how its spelled not loosing) we will be doing a lot of it…being happy about losing this year might be a better use of time than recycling the same naive what if pipe dreams over and over…@ and 1..nash is an old face that no longer can be dangled to recruitand our looted franchise has no assets…please read this …get better informed then if you still need to be a jerk THEN do the name calling ….facts are stubborn things

  • 14 GoSuns // Feb 5, 2012 at 9:25 pm

    Hey Shazam, you do realize that nash is a dream teammate, everybody that comes here can’t wait to talk about how they cant wait to be in the same offense as nash, so you obviously arent keeping up with the times especially if you wanna end up likethe kings,wolves, wizards who dont even have a slim chance of being relevant most years, i’ll take my 4th winningiest franchise in terms of wins that might have a few down years any day over those franchizes, #keepnashinthevalley

  • 15 Cam // Feb 5, 2012 at 9:28 pm

    I guess I will add in my two cents. I like the Batum deal with Portland if Portland is willing to take a bad deal off of the Suns books with Nash, ie Warrick. The only glaring negative to this deal is that it would be a stretch for the Suns to try and get Nolan Smith thrown in instead of or with Felton. I don’t like Felton’s game and this next draft seems to be running thin at the PG position. If the Suns could get Portlands 1st, Batum, and Nolan Smith instead of Felton and maybe push to get a bad contract off the books I think it would be a steal for Phoenix. Alas I ask for too much, the numbers probably don’t jive, and there is no way Portlands front office is as inept in making trades as the Suns. For all we know the Suns would trade Nash and their 1st round pick for some mediocre player with “upside.”. Go Suns.

  • 16 Cam // Feb 5, 2012 at 9:30 pm

    IMHO if it took taking Felton to get rid of a bad contract then I don’t think it would be such a bad deal after all if Nolan Smith was added in to sweeten the pot. Go Suns.

  • 17 steve // Feb 5, 2012 at 9:48 pm

    I didn’t call you an idiot in this thread. But I don’t understand the thought that the suns can only get a stud through the draft. Assuming that is some of the best fortune-telling I’ve ever seen. You should just run the whole team and pick that stud for us.

  • 18 shazam // Feb 5, 2012 at 9:55 pm

    @ cam totally agree @ go suns of course they say that…if they dont they will never see the ball…im talking about this year and guess what the kings wizzards and wolves have much better talent and future than we do..a little better coaching and another years experience and they will be in the mix…we will still be homering an old ball hog who cant mentor and dictates an offense only he can run….you really should read this http://www.brightsideofthesun.com/2012/1/28/2755051/view-of-one-fan-rebuilding-the-suns#storyjump GO SUNS

  • 19 shazam // Feb 5, 2012 at 10:02 pm

    never said you called me an idiot steve a commenter named and 1 did…never said anyone is 100 percent able to pick a stud…but i say the odds of rebuilding the team using drafts is a lot stronger than winning just enough games to not get a high draft pick…and you know that steve u and i have discussed the odds of building the team w/ the babby con or going for drafts before….you REALLY should read this…has anyone bothered to read this? or is it just a simpler life to wear blinders and say go suns ?….PLEASE READ THIS http://www.brightsideofthesun.com/2012/1/28/2755051/view-of-one-fan-rebuilding-the-suns#storyjump

  • 20 GoSuns // Feb 5, 2012 at 10:15 pm

    Shazam, i’ve read it, i do agree with some points but there is one main issue that you just alluded to and that is what happens if you’re stud is not a stud, then trading nash would have been for nothing and free agents definitely wont want to come here

  • 21 shazam // Feb 5, 2012 at 10:54 pm

    free agents dont want to come here anyway….so you then wait and draft the next year if your stud doesnt pan out…your flaw is that you think free agents want to come to this franchise so they can play with nash…sorry bro thats just not the case anymore…the only thing nash provides the suns these days is a few extra wins…just enough to get us a lousy draft pick…wouldnt the team be more fun to root for if we had a bunch of players with upside to pull for…even if they lose at least its something to have hope in…..we know for sure our team is a loser these days…id like to at least watch some chance at developmentlllhey thanks for reading that argument if that was all you questioned after reading it then we arent that far apart mah brutha…look i have loved the suns since 72…im just tired of mediocre and not having a championship in my life time so my patience has run out…last year i was very skeptical but stayed a homer…this year im calling out the front office con

  • 22 shazam // Feb 5, 2012 at 11:04 pm

    will some one please name a free agent that will help us win a championship who wants to come to phoenix with or with out nash being here?…if anyone can do this ill listen…if no one can then you should listen to me…if they arent a super free agent then we are still just a middling team.

  • 23 And1 // Feb 5, 2012 at 11:35 pm

    @Shazam

    You’re an idiot thinking that nobody wants to play with Nash. Big time idiot.

    You say the Kings, Wolves, Wizards have great talent, that’s true they do, just like the Knicks. But what good is talent without a point guard to utilize it at its full potential, and that’s what Steve Nash does even if he’s turning 38.

    This franchise didn’t become a winning team by betting their chances on the draft. No, they traded for good players while keeping their faces.

    If you really have a winning mentality, why in the hell would you let go someone who not only is consistent & plays to win every game, but all makes everyone great around you? It just doesn’t make any sense? ??

    Nash’s value is equal to that of Dirk, Kobe, Lebron, for atleast 3 more years. So if there is going to be any trades happening, it has to be in an exchange for an elite player. If not, then you’re making a mistake that similar of an impact as Amare Stoudamire’s. You can’t give up on Amare thinking you can bring in Hedo, Hakeem, and a bunch of wings to take his plays.

    We all took Amare’s talent for granted, our best draft pick player since Shawn Marion. Let’s not do the same with Nash. I can understand if it’s a trade like Marion for Shaq, we all took a gamble of Shaq. Unfortunately, Shaq wasn’t the right part for the face Nash, Richardson was. But if it took Richardson for Gortat to come to Phoenix and fill in the missing center Suns has been looking for in years, then that’s what I call a good trade.

  • 24 And1 // Feb 5, 2012 at 11:47 pm

    But now do you see what’s happening? Now that the Suns found their long time searching of a Center in Gortat since Joe Klein & Danny Schayes, now they sorely are missing a great wing player like Richardson, Marion, or Stoudamire. And to lose a great point guard like Nash would mean doom. How many great point guards are there to make their teammates great? None, unless you got a freak like Derrick Rose, or a smart player like CP3 you can live without a Nash.

    I would definitely trade Nash for Rubio

  • 25 And1 // Feb 5, 2012 at 11:51 pm

    I would trade Nash for Rubio

  • 26 shazam // Feb 6, 2012 at 12:05 am

    @ and 1 “Nash’s value is equal to that of Dirk, Kobe, Lebron, for atleast 3 more years”…sorry dude you have no credibility with a sentence like that…you should change your internet name to reflect your brain cells…change it to and NONE…u call me an idiot?….bwahahahaha….you silly clown shoe…me thinks you might be slurping on nashs..oh never mind…kids might be reading

  • 27 shazam // Feb 6, 2012 at 12:09 am

    there is an abundance of game changing guards these days just like there used to be an abundance of centers 10 years ago…. your argument is 5 years out dated…take the nash posters you have hanging above your bed on the ceiling down and get a life

  • 28 shazam // Feb 6, 2012 at 12:25 am

    ive noticed that no one can name a really good free agent who will come to the phoenix suns with or with out steve nash….we can TALK about 2 times value for future teams but cant cite a single game changing player

  • 29 Mike Levkowitz // Feb 6, 2012 at 3:45 am

    Hey all – We (over at Not Your Father’s Water Cooler) came up with a few Steve Nash trades I think Steve Nash fans might enjoy (my personal favorite moves Nash to Memphis) – Check them out at http://nyfwc.com/?p=3200 if you are interested.

  • 30 JDMA // Feb 6, 2012 at 5:03 am

    If your Steve Nash would you rather look back in 10 years at a cheap ring which no one really gives you credit for (a la jason kidd) or would you rather retire a Sun, lauded as the greatest to ever wear purple and gold, first ballot hall of famer, retired jersey the lot. Watching Steve nash retire on any other team just wouldnt look right. Imagine Magic not retiring a Laker or Bird a Celtic. I’d rather say I watched Steve nash most of his career then pointlessly trade him so we can bottom out for 3+ seasons. IMO.

  • 31 Penny Hardaway // Feb 6, 2012 at 5:30 am

    @JDMA

    Exactly. But idiots like Shazam wouldn’t what that is like. That is called integrity & honor. Shazam is one of those guys who’d cheat to win. No honor of whatsoever. To me, having Nash retire as a Sun is equal to having won a Championship. Nuff said.

  • 32 Penny Hardaway // Feb 6, 2012 at 5:44 am

    @Shazam

    yeah there’s an abundance of changing guards that’s true. Why do you think that is? Cause they suck. You can have a point guard with a potential like the Iversons or the CP3s, but in the end consistency is the key to great success.. Why do you think Nash lasted this long outlasting his peers like Iverson, Marbury, J Williams, etc..

    Even the young athletic guards of today pale in comparison to Nash during an off-night. What separates the best from the rest is focus, and Nash brings that every game, similar to that of Jordan, Kobe, etc… Focus. Something you undervalue from Nash cause you’re an idiot. So the poster stays up on the ceiling.

  • 33 shazam // Feb 6, 2012 at 6:12 am

    i think nash is one of the best but we cant find talent to help him out…no one can name a f a that will come here…so we have to get our talent from the draft….nash helps us win just enough games to not get a good draft pick….you all are speaking from emotion mixed with vitriol at me because it doesnt fit in to your happy land of mediocrity that you have been trained to accept in phoenix…its sports for chrise sakes…yes…winning is THE yard stick that matters the rest of that dribble coming from you all is just excuses because the benefits of trading nash i guess is just too complicated for you…and trust me when people look back they wont think jason kidds ring is cheap..its getting hard to respond to people who post sentences that blatantly out of whack with reality and throw name calling in with it…..name me a game changing f a who will come to phoenix and read this then you will be informed enough to maybe take out the emotion…name the f a and read this or shut up

  • 34 shazam // Feb 6, 2012 at 6:25 am

    @ JDMA heres your post word for word ill respond at the end

    If your Steve Nash would you rather look back in 10 years at a cheap ring which no one really gives you credit for (a la jason kidd) or would you rather retire a Sun, lauded as the greatest to ever wear purple and gold, first ballot hall of famer, retired jersey the lot. Watching Steve nash retire on any other team just wouldnt look right. Imagine Magic not retiring a Laker or Bird a Celtic. I’d rather say I watched Steve nash most of his career then pointlessly trade him so we can bottom out for 3+ seasons. IMO.

    1/i dont care what steve nash wants..this is a biz about winning…my loyalty isnt to 2 time its to the phx suns winning
    2/jason kidd will be respected for that ring in years to come and now by everyone but you
    3 sorry how nash retiring somewhere else might look to you but to compare his retirement to magic and birds multi winning jerseys is just well down syndrome inspired…the rest of your dribble is just emotional fanboy stuff…name an f a who will come to phx

  • 35 Rich Anthony, (KJL) // Feb 6, 2012 at 6:55 am

    #FreeSteveNash. I have been supporting this for 2 years now.

    Here’s the thing with SNOW – it’s very important to put it out there.

    First, I don’t think anybody who is on the “we need a point guard” side of it is 100% right or wrong. Same with the “we need to suck and draft” crowd. It is a blend of both.

    Yes, Nash needs to be traded for youth that can either be shopped or molded and draft picks. Yes, the team needs to bottom out in order to have a shot at the premier talent coming up through college and / or Europe.
    You don’t need to draft the next great point guard, because chances are the team that drafted that guy won’t be able to hold onto him anyway or, the team he is on when he turns into the next great point guard won’t be able to afford him.

    So for the other side of it, a great point guard is very important.

    MORE IMPORTANT though, is that when this guard becomes available, you have a team that is attractive as hell that he can slide into and instantly transform it into a contender for half a decade.

    Sound familiar? It should. It’s exactly what the Suns did before Nash got back to town. They drafted nice players. Nice enough for Nash to accept the contract he did and come back to the valley.

    So, to those of you on either side, you’re both right 50% – you need both things.

    That being said, Nash won’t be around through whatever avenue the future holds for him the next time this team contends. He’ll either be retired or on another team chasing a ring. That is the cold hard truth of it.
    From a business eye, the arena is half full even with Nash, so it’s not like he’s the cash cow the franchise was hoping for.

    Fans will come out and support a young team with athletic talent more than they’ll come out and support this SNOW-led bunch right now. I guarantee it.

    So yes, deal Nash and let him try for a ring. Eradicate the current roster this summer and try to get as many draft picks / young talent as you can.
    Lets not forget, the only thing more important than a good point guard is a good center. Phoenix has one of those finally and he’s just now entering his prime and he is growing as a player at an alarming rate.

    That is the direction the team should be going. Bring the talented youth back in so that when the Rubios and Walls become available, they’ll actually think about signing in the valley.

    **** Though… none of this would be as painful if the Dragon wasn’t traded away with a draft pick for nothing.

  • 36 shazam // Feb 6, 2012 at 7:52 am

    well rich i agree w/ u 100 percent…its exactly what ive been saying…of course emo fan boys took me out of context and only focused on my trade nash part of the argument.

  • 37 Scott // Feb 6, 2012 at 8:18 am

    @Mike Levkowitz -

    Those are all terrible trades, for various reasons. Completely unrealistic.

  • 38 steve // Feb 6, 2012 at 8:51 am

    I’m just curious about something. You guys who believe this FO id among the worst in the NBA… why are you calling for them to make moves? I mean, if they’re so awful, why would you actually want them to take any further action? Obviously they’re just going to screw utter up, right?

    @shazam- you keep asking anyone to name big FAs who want to come here… Do we know where ANY big FA wants to go? I certainly don’t. And even if you want to assume that no one wants to come to the valley, why do you act as if the only way to acquire big name players is through free agency? Most big names actually change jersey through trades, and there is even LESS accuracy in guessing who might come to PHX through a trade. Translation: you’re taking the easy way out in assuming the worst with no hope for the best. It’s easier to bet on losers than it is to bet on winners. I’ll throw down my life savings to say that the bucks will never win another championship, but does that mean their fans should just forsake them? I understand where your pessimism comes from, but I think you believe you’re a lot nobler and more influential than you truly are. The cowards abandon ship first…

  • 39 GoSuns // Feb 6, 2012 at 9:24 am

    FAs besides gordon and batum (Gerald has a player option)
    I would look into the possibility of a sign-and-trade at the end of the season for nash to the sixers for jrue holiday, I would also look at the possiblity of signing Louis Williams
    Antwan Jamison
    Michael Beasely, we might could offer him more than what the wolves will
    There might have been a few others i saw depending on if they were restricted or had an team option but i def think there are a few fas that we can bring in

  • 40 GoSuns // Feb 6, 2012 at 9:25 am

    and go ahead throw in oj mayo to that list

  • 41 Rich Anthony, (KJL) // Feb 6, 2012 at 9:30 am

    Okay, a couple of things.

    NOBODY SHOULD WANT MICHAEL BEASELY. I certainly don’t want that headache on the Suns. May as well try to land World Peace as well in that case.

    Also, I think a lot of us need to stop thinking about the free agency class of this ONE YEAR coming up. It’s about getting the proper players in place to find the superstar free agent, when he becomes available, that fits perfectly.

    The only guy who I would want the suns to seriously look at would be Deron, and if they did that, they would have to land home runs in the draft to have any shot at getting him to sign.

    If he did sign, then it makes getting others into the Valley easier, but that probably isn’t going to happen when he has far better immediate options.

    Better to get the franchise headed in the right direction, make Gortat happy during that time, and be ready for the next crop of superstar free agents in 2 seasons.

  • 42 Bin // Feb 6, 2012 at 10:01 am

    Even though Nash was the one that introduced me to NBA in Mavs and the Suns, I think it’s time to let him go. While I do not cherish the idea of Nash playing somewhere else, the Suns would be better off making use of this shortened season to start the rebuilding process.

    If the Suns’ front office could acquire a pick (preferably a 1st rounder 2012) and a young player still on his rookie contract then it would be better instead of letting Nash walk away after the season ends.

  • 43 Tony // Feb 6, 2012 at 10:12 am

    Steve,

    I personally have no faith in the Suns front office to draft the player, which is a major reason why I’m not in favor of tanking, besides the negative conotations associated with a franchise that deliberately losses. It’s just disresepectful to the team’s players, coaches, and fans.

    With that being said, even the Suns stooges in the front office would have a difficult time messing up a pick in this upcoming draft as it’s so loaded with talent. But I wouldn’t put it past Sarver to sell the pick!

    Shazam is right in that the draft is really the only hope this franchise has in the immediate future to land its next star player. The team has no tradeable assets that will land a star player and considering how bad this team is and Nash’s age, it’s extremely unlikely any star player signs with the Suns anytime soon, especially since there are so many unknowns about the direction of the team and also Sarver’s reputation doesn’t make it any easier.

    @And1,

    let’s cut out calling people idiots please. There’s a completely legitimate argument in trading Nash. He’s my favorite player but comparing him at this point to Lebron, Dirk, or Kobe is plain silly. A couple years ago it would fair to make that comparison, but not know. Nash is too old to build around, so even though I’m not necessarily for it, trading Nash will bring at least some value in return and will ensure the Suns do get a top 3 pick in a very deep draft. Plus, I don’t know what you think, but it’s a shame that Nash is wasting away his remaining productive years for a team that will be lucky to be 12th in the western conference. I would much rather see Nash play some more in the playoffs.

    Rich,

    if you want to make Gortat happy, then he’s going to want Nash to stay a Sun for a while longer. From everything Gortat’s said, he loves playing with Nash.

  • 44 shazam // Feb 6, 2012 at 12:26 pm

    @ steve your quote —-> “I’m just curious about something. You guys who believe this FO id among the worst in the NBA… why are you calling for them to make moves?”..im only calling for them to make moves they are proven to be good at…moves that insure we lose more games..so we can get a better draft pick…asking them to do something smart is the wrong use of the animal…its like putting a plow behind Sea Biscuit…
    @ steve your quote—-> “why do you act as if the only way to acquire big name players is through free agency? Most big names actually change jersey through trades, and there is even LESS accuracy in guessing who might come to PHX through a trade.”….when was the last time you saw a block buster trade that didnt include a high draft pick or a young stud that had been drafted?even the lakers sweet heart deal for pau had to give up a good draft…you have to start some where my brother and these days it always goes back to the draft
    @ steve your quote—>”I’ll throw down my life savings to say that the bucks will never win another championship”..at least the bucks have a championship thats all i ask for…how did they get it?…well there was this coin flip that draft year..the suns lost we took connie hawkins(youtube him)…the bucks took a guy named lou alcinder…you might know him as kareem abdul jabar (youtube him)…the bucks won a championship because of what? …THE DRAFT..
    @ steve your quote—->”I think you believe you’re a lot nobler and more influential than you truly are. The cowards abandon ship first”…everyone thinks they are a lot nobler than they really are and YOU are no exception..ive been a fan since before you prolly knew there was a city called phx….i havent abandoned any ship…you are calling me a coward because we disagree on how to build the ship

  • 45 shazam // Feb 6, 2012 at 12:37 pm

    @ steve your quote—>”I’ll throw down my life savings to say that the bucks will never win another championship”….. i would take you up on it but i dont want the hassle of chasing you down for a nickel..haha /jk…prolly not too far off tho
    :)

  • 46 steve // Feb 6, 2012 at 12:47 pm

    Your draft comments are stretches. Every significant player in NBA history has been drafted, so of course good drafts are precursors to a lot of championships. You also have to remember free agency is a fairly new concept and trades happen much more frequently these days due to the “win or die” mentality and the lack of loyalty to a team/city. There wasn’t as much opportunity for big names to switch teams back in the day. Anyway, shaq was traded twice, leading to four championships. Billups wasn’t a piston originally. Garnett wasn’t a Celtic (and they sucked before he got there). Kobe was acquired in a trade (granted, a draft day trade). It’s not hard to find just as many examples of studs turning teams around after coming to them through FA or trades. Alcindor did most of his damage with the Lakers, for instance. Wilt won his after a trade.

    Btw, Connie hawkins is my second favorite sun of all time. Seriously underrated.

  • 47 shazam // Feb 6, 2012 at 12:52 pm

    good points steve…hey bro remember when connie would get the ball and the crowd would chant “swoop hawk swoop”…totally agree with you about connie loved watching that guy…he was dr j before there was a dr. j

  • 48 steve // Feb 6, 2012 at 1:08 pm

    Fyi, I’m more for building through the draft, like you. I was just kinda curious to see what your thought process was since I know you believe this FO is completely incompetent. I’ve wanted to turn nash into some other assets for a couple of years now,but this far into his career and contract, I think we’re at a point where nash wouldn’t net us anything except a better pick for ourselves. We’re already going to be top 10, so I’m not sure if jumping a few spots is really going to be worth it any more.

    I would do it and just get what I can for him and throw the season. But that’s a lot easier for me to say from my phone at my office than it probably is for guys like Blanks and Sarver, who have jobs and/or millions of dollars riding on Steve nash and this whole ordeal’s outcome.

  • 49 shazam // Feb 6, 2012 at 1:18 pm

    check out the difference between top 5 and 5-10 drafts in league history….HUGE difference……u know me steve i use over the top silliness to make points and get comments started in a dull season like “steve nashs rich kids are holding our franchise hostage”…bwahahaha i dont believe it..its satire because there is a truth there if you let your mind extrapolate….my front office views are the same way…is sarver a naive trust fund sucker?…prolly…why else would he take on so many bad deals and then hire the agent who sold them to him(babby)…is babby bad now that we have him?…too soon to tell

  • 50 steve // Feb 6, 2012 at 1:18 pm

    Also, I don’t remember in the sense that my voice was among those in the old coliseum. You caught me on being young, but I have a love of the old school game that the current crop of NBA talent just can’t surpass. Since about 1999, I haven’t enjoyed the NBA. I still love the suns, but I consider the NBA as a whole a pretty pathetic league.

  • 51 And1 // Feb 6, 2012 at 2:10 pm

    I would definitely trade Nash for both Derrick Williams & Rubio. I think the Wolves wouldn’t mind it as well knowing they have three good solid point guards to spare & good wing players. Plus Love would benefit from playing with STeve and the Wolves would then be a legit contender with that trade. Suns then will have a future point guard, a solid wing, and a center in Gortat. Everyone should be happy with that trade. I would definitely push for that trade if Nash decides to leave.

  • 52 Big Daddy // Feb 6, 2012 at 2:13 pm

    Let’s be realistic here, Nobody want’s an aging superstar who has maybe 2 good years left in him. He’s the most loyal player around to his fans/teammates he’s not gonna pull a stat move. On top of that, he’s got personal reasons to remain at phx(kids etc.)

  • 53 shazam // Feb 6, 2012 at 2:45 pm

    @ tony…dude i wish i could articulate as clearly as you…this one paragraph of yours incapsulates everything ive been trying to say better than my reams and reams of blather…you rock …for those who missed it heres tonys quote ” the draft is really the only hope this franchise has in the immediate future to land its next star player. The team has no tradeable assets that will land a star player and considering how bad this team is and Nash’s age, it’s extremely unlikely any star player signs with the Suns anytime soon, especially since there are so many unknowns about the direction of the team and also Sarver’s reputation doesn’t make it any easier.” = PERFECT

  • 54 Mel. // Feb 6, 2012 at 3:36 pm

    … a lot to cover in this discussion, and tons of points that I agree with wholeheartedly. However, I think I’ll relegate my comment to flipping the figurative bird at Chris Palmer, who’s undercut the serious Nash trade-chatter with the crappiest plug-nickel comment conceivable to any self-respecting Suns fan:

    “Suns open to trading Steve Nash. How about for Derek Fisher and Metta World Peace?”

    You know, I thought that the whole “Luke Walton, MWP and a third-round draft pick for D12″ crap was hilarious, but… man. It loses its luster when the Lake Show’s Veruca Salt school of Player Transactions pops up on the doorstep of your OWN franchise.

    I mean… seriously? This is ESPN’s idea of stirring the pot? Swapping Nash for two overpaid, role-playing also-rans who cashed out their chips in 2010 and whose collective stat lines don’t even match up to Nash’s diminished numbers for this season? Based on–I’m guessing–the fallacy that “everybody wants to play with Kobe” and that Nash (like Gary Payton before him) is so desperate to flush his Phoenix role for DAT RING that he’ll go running to a team that isn’t going to make it to the Finals, even WITH him starting at the one?

    Man, I’ve gotta pump the brakes before I fill another six pages with ranting obscenities about how damn stupid that proposal is. Not like I’m not preaching to the choir, here.

  • 55 shazam // Feb 6, 2012 at 4:07 pm

    wow mel i just heard about this…must be a slow news day at espn nba…totally rawdickless

  • 56 Mel. // Feb 6, 2012 at 4:23 pm

    LOL, shaz. That’s what I said. I tried to plug that trade into NBA 2K12 and the XBox spat the disc at me and started laughing right out of its feed-tray, somehow.

  • 57 shazam // Feb 6, 2012 at 4:29 pm

    bwahahahahahha @ “spat the disc at me”

  • 58 Rich Anthony, (KJL) // Feb 6, 2012 at 4:42 pm

    “Rich,

    if you want to make Gortat happy, then he’s going to want Nash to stay a Sun for a while longer. From everything Gortat’s said, he loves playing with Nash.”

    @ Tony, I don’t believe that is 100% accurate.

    I’m sure he does like playing with Nash, but I think even he understands that he has another year, at most, with SNOW and while Two-Time is the face of the franchise, he’s going to compliment him.

    At the same time, Gortat is chained to a system tailored to Nash with Nash as the focal point. I don’t think he’d mind being the new point of focus where his touches skyrocket and [if only for a little while] he is the face of a franchise that is hopefully heading in the right direction.

  • 59 shazam // Feb 6, 2012 at 8:14 pm

    rarely does a player say anything that you can count on..especially a suns player.. its like they are programmed to be nice..they dont have a bryant or a jordan in their dna…teams dont have to have that in their dna to make it see mavs,spurs…we arent talking about “making it”…we are talking about what players SAY…think of our suns and most athletes as politicians…they say whats best to keep their job or keep their job easy even if they dont mean it…every sun to a man …even if its their first day will say “i love playing with steve nash”…really price,telefar,brooks and many more for other reasons?…2 time is one of the best in history but he has the ball on average 2o seconds per possession to become that….pretty much unheard of…that has to rankle some players

  • 60 Rich Anthony, (KJL) // Feb 6, 2012 at 9:29 pm

    Right.

    I mentioned the Ewing Theory before in regards to Nash and I do believe it to be so for the Suns.

    If he goes, not only would others step up, (meaning those who survive the off-season), but a new system can be put in place that would mesh far better with the personnel in house.

    You could actually groom some youth instead of demanding they fit into a Nash-specific role. Morris is being ruined because he plays with Nash and Gentry keeps him outside like he is Channing Frye. He has some touch but its obvious his game is suited for more than this.

  • 61 shazam // Feb 6, 2012 at 10:25 pm

    rich you so nailed it bro..but be careful with that opinion on this site… 9 year old emo fan boys get their panties all up in a bunch…nash is their first crush…they dont understand its just puppy love and a new shiny object will be hyped their way instantly…it will be a very hard transition for them..the thought of having to rip 2 times poster off the ceiling above their bed and having to find a new boyfriend gives them extreme anxiety..they have been known to borrow mommies computer and call people names…be prepared..hell hath no fury like an emo fan boy scorned.

  • 62 Mike L // Feb 6, 2012 at 11:20 pm

    When will Suns fans ever learn??? Since when will trading Nash be a smart move? What, no one remembers banging on Sarver for letting Johnson head to ATL and for getting rid of Amare? We can hammer on him for that, but WE’RE suddenly OK to whine and moan about how we need to trade Nash, who is 10 TIMES the impact player either of guys were COMBINED?? COME ON PEOPLE!!! WAKE UP!!!!!!!!!!

  • 63 shazam // Feb 6, 2012 at 11:51 pm

    mike you WOKE UP too late..this party is over and you didnt read all the threads,,,in short we have no assets because we dont have amare or joe except to surround old 2 time with ..time to re-build….you can go back to sleep now zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

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