Eric Gordon inks offer sheet with Phoenix Suns, the wait is on

Posted by on July 11th, 3:05 pm

PHOENIX — The Phoenix Suns finally got that offer sheet signed by New Orleans restricted free agent Eric Gordon, the team announced today.

The Hornets will have three days to match the four-year, $58 million offer, something that ESPN’s Ric Bucher said they would do. The news came in a few hours after Suns president of basketball operations Lon Babby said there were “no meaningful discussions” regarding a sign-and-trade for the 6-foot-3 guard prior to the offer sheet being signed.

“They didn’t really want to engage in those discussions,” said Babby, who held a press conference on Wednesday afternoon to talk about the Steve Nash trade to the Los Angeles Lakers.

Babby didn’t hint at knowing whether the Hornets would match the offer.

“We’ll see what they do,” he said. “We’re a pretty carefully prepared bunch … and we just have to play it out. We know the risks associated with it and have our plans mapped out accordingly to hopefully getting Eric.

“If they for some reason decide to match despite his desires to be here, then we will be ready to move in that direction,” Babby added. “There’s certainly a disadvantage to having your money tied up, but those are the rules.”

At the earlier presser, Babby expressed his pleasure with the recruitment of Gordon. Whether New Orleans matches or not, the signed offer sheet will undoubtedly be used as proof that the Suns’ front office can recruit free agents to the desert.

And in what is the first regularly-scheduled offseason with Babby and general manager Lance Blanks running the show, the recruiting pitch to Gordon — perhaps the second-best free agent target behind Deron Williams — can be viewed as a positive sign.

“At the time Lance and I have been here, we have done everything we can to enhance those things that make this a player-friendly environment,” Babby said. “We were just champing at the bit to present our case to free agents. Eric Gordon was really the first one who came in.

Added Babby: “We made our recruiting pitch, we presented who were were as an organization, we introduced him to Robert (Sarver), we introduced him to our staff, our entire organization rallied around the entire effort. They met him on the street, we delivered materials to him, but most importantly, he got the sense how badly he was wanted here. He left wanting to be here, and expressing that his heart was in Phoenix, I think was the phrase he used.”

Of course, the success will be significantly better for Phoenix if Eric Gordon is walking through those US Airways Center doors in the coming week.

Kevin Zimmerman is the lead blogger and editor for Valley of the Suns. He is also editor of, an Arizona Wildcats\’ blog, and a contributor at SB Nation and

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Tags: Eric Gordon · Phoenix Suns · Phoenix Suns News

60 responses so far ↓

  • 1 Andres // Jul 11, 2012 at 3:07 pm

    I hope Nola doesnt match. However if they do I think that Babby and Co have a good Plan B.

  • 2 Mike L // Jul 11, 2012 at 3:10 pm

    My money was on a S&&T happening in the background despite the lack of any evidence. I think they match and I’m honestly fine with that, even if it means not getting Mayo or others. If it’s max money we’re trying to spend, spend on it a max-type player only … or save it for next year. I like Dragic being re-signed and I’m interested to see what Beasley amounts to. We’ll see what happens!

  • 3 steve // Jul 11, 2012 at 3:20 pm

    I’m fairly certain the Suns can kiss Gordon good-bye. I thought a sign-and-trade was the way to get Gordon here, but now that that’s no longer a possibility, I don’t think there’s any way NO lets Gordon go for nothing.

    Too bad. I wanted to see Gordon in a Suns uni.

  • 4 Elviro (Italy) // Jul 11, 2012 at 3:21 pm

    anxiously waiting in Italy ……
    well Dragic and beasley …
    Gordon would be the cherry on the cake …
    but if it will happen and there are other stars in that role …. you could reingaggiare supporting actor … keep some space under the salary cap and wait until next season to take a top player …

  • 5 thatdude // Jul 11, 2012 at 3:44 pm

    Why would they let the guy they traded for CP3 sign wit ANYBODY else? They’ll match and of course they cant trade him to us for the next 4 years so Im interested in plan B?? Its clear this team will struggle to win 30 games next year as currently constructed.

  • 6 Tony // Jul 11, 2012 at 3:44 pm

    “There’s certainly a disadvantage to having your money tied up, but those are the rules.” Excuse me Mr. Babby, I know you are a hot-shot attorney/agent, but don’t the rules also allow you to have withdrawn your max offer to Gordon before he signed it?? Similar to what Portland did with Hibbert….. These guys never cease to amaze me! So now onto Plan B…., overpay for Mayo, unless of course he’s signed with the Pacers before the 3 day period the Hornets have to match the offer to Gordon. In the event of the latter, Plan C will be in effect: “At least we tried……”

  • 7 sturmtank // Jul 11, 2012 at 4:18 pm

    honestly, im fine now. i didnt like the idea of a s&t and giving up either dud or marshall along with 2 1st rounders. if nola matches, so be it. if not we have eg … im fine with either one.

    obviously the fo can do whatever they want, you’ll never be satisfied. we dont know the details and if you read on yahoo, hornets gm says “no comment” about matching, that doesnt sound like impossible that we get him. very similat to the jj situation we had. sarver also decided not to spend 60mil$ on a guy who doesnt want to be here. and if its known that eg doesnt want to be there it’ll be tough to get good value in a trade.

    and by the way; dragic, beasley and 4 picks (2 pate 1st rounders which i like to either pick or use in a trade) for nash and hill looks good to me! rebuilding is not done in 1 offseason, so if we neither get eg nor mayo just move on. 5 1st founders the next 3 years + a lot of cap + still bring able to use the amnesty gives us a LOT of flexibility in the future!!!!!

    i would resign redd for 2 yrs 4-5 mil total, i think he needs our trainig stuff and will stay for that. maybe try to snag brand fora fair price and move on if nola matches…

    to me: so far so good. well done fo!

  • 8 Andy // Jul 11, 2012 at 4:18 pm

    What’s the explanation for not having this done by midnight last night? The Hornets can now kill 72 hours, and its pretty customary in the NBA to take the full time to screw the other team. (To be fair, I advocated exactly that plan as a cover for a year of tanking, but that was before we put in 7 years and 50-odd million on Beasley and Dragic.) Knowing that we were going to match it, and knowing they’re free to take all of the time to do so, why didn’t we have this signed first thing this morning to minimize the amount of time we missed? Having waited nearly a whole day just seems lazy, and wasteful. Is there any interpretation of that move that doesn’t just speak to an amateurish approach by the FO?

  • 9 bk // Jul 11, 2012 at 4:19 pm

    Team allows to be 15% below the salary cap. So, assuming no Gordon and not amnesty ChildressWarrick. The team has to spend about at least $10M (including re-sign Lopez).

  • 10 Jason A. // Jul 11, 2012 at 4:23 pm

    @Tony you never cease to amaze me. The actions of this front office are sure to be getting noticed around the league. S&T Nash to the lakers, following through with an offer sheet even though it might hurt us, bringing guys in and signing every one of them. We’re a player-friendly franchise and it will pay dividends down the road.

    Also, don’t be confused into thinking this offer sheet to Gordon will limit us. If OJ Mayo has waited this long he will hold out a few days more. Why wouldn’t he want to play for Phoenix? I bet we get him for 3 yrs/ $21 mil. So solid…

  • 11 Andy // Jul 11, 2012 at 4:47 pm

    Thanks… I’ll try not to be “confused.” But whether or not Mayo waits really isn’t the question. The question is why we put ourselves in a position to forfeit an additional 15 hours of free agency we didn’t have to – unless someone has an explanation for that delay. This front office has totally failed to develop any sort of coherent long-term plan, and consistently makes the sorts of little mistakes well-run teams don’t make. This is just another example of that.

    Also, it’s not hard to sign every guy you bring in when you overpay for them like crazy. Beasley is coming off the worst year of a career that has his b-r similarity score in the Danny Fortson/Leon Powe range, and we offered him 3 years and almost 20 million. The best defense is “he was a number two pick” – so were Thabeet and Darko. Or, maybe more accurately, that’s only one pick higher than Adam Morrison, another high-scoring college player who didn’t find a position or a go-to move in the pros. I’d love to see this work out, but this wasn’t “let’s take a flier” money, this was “this guy is going to be a mainstay in our rotation” money.

  • 12 sturmtank // Jul 11, 2012 at 4:48 pm

    rather than always rip the fo – whtevef they do – come up with a proposal. yeah sure: get d-will, get howard … sure. not even when all sides are ready it means that it’ll happen.

    i also feel thatmayo waits another 3 days and will sign with the suns ifnola matches.

  • 13 Jeremiah // Jul 11, 2012 at 4:54 pm

    @Jason A…Couldn’t agree more with your comment.

    @Toney…Keep in mind the Suns only intended in the first place to use this as a way to show fans that they were willing to put money on the line for talented players. Also look at it from the perspective of current and future free agents that could potentially sign here. If they were to pull out of this deal last second it would give them a bad image with future free agents and that certainly isn’t good business.

  • 14 Ty-Sun // Jul 11, 2012 at 5:01 pm

    Regarding Mayo, the upper level teams that want him can’t afford him. He’s a second tier scorer according to Weisert’s scale. Good but not quite good enough to spend big money on for the top teams. If NO matches the Gordon offer – which I actually hope they do – the Suns should go after Mayo at 7-8 mil a year for 3 years. Any more than that and they are overpaying him. Any less than that then they are getting a bargain. Mayo has been under used in Memphis. I think he can contribute MUCH more to a team that give him the green light to score. Memphis has Gay,
    Randolph and Gasol… all scoring options BEFORE Mayo while he was there. I think that is why he never really shined as a scorer while he was with Memphis. With the Suns he will be the #1 or at least the #2 scoring option. I think that alone should propel him to a career high in scoring.

  • 15 Scott // Jul 11, 2012 at 5:05 pm

    Even if the Suns strike out on adding more FAs this season, what they did get in free agency and the draft is enough to put forth a more competitive team than last year’s.

    They’ll need to stretch a bit till Frye comes back, and they may need to bring in a replacement for Lopez, but otherwise they have all the basic spots covered.

    Starters: Dragic, Dudley, Beasley, Frye, Gortat
    2nd unit: Marshall, Childress, Warrick, Morris, Lopez.

    The first unit really creates space for Dragic to move. Unlike the last squad Gentry ran him with (which at best had a single perimeter shooter), this one has everyone but Gortat at the 3 pt line. On defense, this group is also fairly good, with Beasley probably being the weakest link.

    I believe the 2nd unit will look a lot better with Marshall at the helm, even with no Redd or Brown. Childress comes up to SG for defensive purposes, and consequently is available for leak outs and transition buckets. Warrick may be the weak spot on defense in this group, but he can shoot or drive from the corner, or hit the jumper. Morris can space the floor, and Robin can run the pick and roll. Essentially, it’s a mirror of the first unit, except slightly more weakness on shooting the corner 3 from Warrick, and no perimeter threat from Childress.

    Assuming Gentry actually plays the team this way, the 2nd unit may hold up a lot better than it did last season.

    As I’ve mentioned before, if there are no more reasonable moves to make in free agency, the Suns could possibly get by with bringing in a few minimum contracts to play in practices and provide depth. Someone like SG Zoran Dragic, F John Shurna, and C Garret Siler. One of these has played in the Suns system before (Siler), two have a good relationship with Goran (Garret and Zoran), and one of them is a 6′ 10″ sharpshooter with a high IQ and good motor (Shurna).

    If Zoran simply is not an option, and no other minimum SG looks good, then consider Brown. He at least knows the system now, and Marshall should be able to manage him better than Telfair did. Bringing in Brown, the Suns could put him at 2nd SG and move Childress to SF, putting Warrick on the bench.

    Telfair, of course, is the 3rd PG, and that brings the roster count to 14.

    Naturally, the Suns FO probably won’t do something this sensible. Not because of Sarver (lol), but because of Blanks not picking the right people, and because Gentry will probably screw up the rotations as he usually does.

  • 16 Tony // Jul 11, 2012 at 5:06 pm

    You’re right, that was a silly post. I’m going to try to have a more positive and stable outlook from now on. Thanks guys!

  • 17 joey // Jul 11, 2012 at 5:22 pm

    dude quit hating. i can’t believe you would compare beasley to adam morrison, darko, or thabeet. YOU’RE FREAKING CRAZY!!! beasley has a 17ppg average while those other scrubs can’t even get off the bench or even make a nba roster for that matter. beasley is a very good scorer with ridiculous upside. granted he does need more maturity and better fundamentals, but so do most other 23yr olds. so you’re comments are total bs bro. the fo is doing damn solid thus far. we have a ton of picks coming and even more cap space next year. whether we get gordon or mayo, either one is a huge upgrade at sg. if we get neither, so what, its just more cap space for next year. suns are back on the rise!

  • 18 steve // Jul 11, 2012 at 5:28 pm

    Jason said: “@Tony… don’t be confused”

    Andy said: “Thanks… I’ll try not to be ‘confused.’ ”

    Maybe it’s just an honest mistake and this Andy character misread Jason’s post and thought Jason was talking to him (or maybe he joined in on the conversation without being asked, whatever the case), but maybe Tony just forgot to change his name before posting again. I don’t know.

    And then we get this gem:

    “You’re right, that was a silly post. I’m going to try to have a more positive and stable outlook from now on. Thanks guys!”

    I know for a FACT that wasn’t Tony. Who’s who anymore? I can’t keep this stuff straight.

  • 19 Jason A. // Jul 11, 2012 at 5:32 pm

    @Steve I took it as Andy defending Tony’s ludicrous position and Tony sarcastically dismissing my post. No worries, aside from a brief compliment of the FO after the Dragic and Beasley signings, Tony has remained remarkably obtuse in his appraisal of the FO.

  • 20 Ryan // Jul 11, 2012 at 5:37 pm

    Perhaps a 2-year plan is a better option for the max contract. We can look to next year and try and lure Harden in with a max contract that OKC may not be able to match if they want to keep other pieces together – namely Ibaka. Harden would be another “hometown” player, having been an ASU star, potentially making PHX a desireable destination (I watched him destroy my Wildcats, but would happily watch him do the same to others in Purple and Orange).

    While we run the risk of being in the same situation with Harden (Restricted) as we are currently with Gordon, we’d be making OKC make some really tough decisions about their core and they may not be willing/able to match a max contract for their 3rd option.

    Harden is better player Mayo across the board – get’s to the rim at will, rains from distance, plays the passing lanes and works hard on D/not afraid to guard anyone – and a future with him next year would be much more appealing than OJ Mayo for rounding out the core of Dragic/Beasley/Gortat..

  • 21 Andy // Jul 11, 2012 at 5:38 pm

    Beasley averaged 15 points a game. Not 17. On 13.5 attempts. For his career, Morrison averaged 7.5 points on 7.8 attempts. I’m certainly not saying Beasley isn’t better than Morrison. But there is nothing in his record at this point in the NBA so far to indicate he’s a 6 million dollar a year player. Nothing. “He’s 23, he can get better” is a perfectly plausible argument, but it’s not a reason to pay a guy who does one thing (score, and he’s not very efficient at it) more than the MLE. Especially when there was no indication anyone else as interested in paying that much.

    And no, I was reacting as though Jason was saying someone who was saying having our money tied up by Gordon’s offer (a fact, which even our front office concedes) would be “confused” in thinking that. It was my point as well, whether he directed it to me.

  • 22 Ty-Sun // Jul 11, 2012 at 5:47 pm

    If the Suns miss out on both Gordon and Mayo then I will be VERY disappointed in the FO this year. Getting Gordon is really up to NO but getting Mayo is up to the FO. If he demands more than 8 mil a year for 3 years then they should pass. If he is willing to sign for that or less and they pass on that deal then I will be very upset with them. But if they overpay him I will also be upset with them.

  • 23 joey // Jul 11, 2012 at 5:56 pm

    so who should the suns have went after if not beasley? he was by far the best available unrestricted fa. especially when you factor in age, potential, and his career numbers. the suns have 2 guys making around 6mil who are not even close to beasleys talent, ie frye and childress. so beasleys deal was definitely fair price and not overpaid at all. i played az stars ball with frye when we were both 16. he was weak then and is still weak. especially for someone 6″11. childress has no shot, worse than marion, and is a total waste of 6mil. come on lets get real here.

  • 24 Andy // Jul 11, 2012 at 5:58 pm

    At least we all know that the Suns didn’t make the worst deal of this offseason:

    … what?

  • 25 Andy // Jul 11, 2012 at 6:03 pm

    @Joey. Oh well, if you played high school ball, then BY ALL MEANS.

    No one is arguing with you. Frye’s deal was bad when we signed it. That doesn’t make this less bad. That argument makes no sense and I don’t know what you think you’re saying with it. Overpaying Beasley by LESS than we’re overpaying Frye isn’t an argument that Beasley is properly valued. And sorry, but truth is, Childress actually had better statistics than Beasley when we signed each of them to their respective contract. Look it up. But again, even if he didn’t, it’s not relevant. If your argument is that we keep handing out bad contracts.. I guess we agree?

  • 26 Jason A. // Jul 11, 2012 at 6:06 pm

    Come on @Andy, comparing Beasley to Morrison is not even remotely fair. When Beasley started every game he played for Min two years ago, he scored 30+ points eight times. That’s 8 of 73. He averaged 19.2 points. Sounds like a good contract to me…btw, Morrison is just trying to get a camp invite somewhere.

  • 27 Tony // Jul 11, 2012 at 6:08 pm


    “but maybe Tony just forgot to change his name before posting again. I don’t know.”

    You are really too funny, I mean that sincerely. No, I have not and never will resort to such childish behavior as to pretend to be another person. And as far whomever is apparently pretending to be me, which I bet is that Sun Also Rises Loser, I would never qualify my comments as silly!


    I praised the Suns FO prematurely, and for that, I was mistaken. I had assumed they were going to get Gorden along with Dragic and Beasley.
    In any case, how have I been obtuse in my appraisal of the FO? Personally, I don’t agree that losing Nash and Hill and only getting Dragic, Beasley, and 4 late 1st and 2nd round picks is indicative of Sarver, Babby, and Blanks doing a good job. Now, if those picks suddenly become lottery picks, then that’s a different story. However, the odds of that happening are as good as the Suns winning a championship with Sarver as owner;)

  • 28 Vince // Jul 11, 2012 at 6:12 pm

    I’m still not sure what to think of Eric Gordon… He is undersized but a good scorer. The Suns are still rebuilding and aren’t close to contending. If we do get Gordon, the Suns might fall back into that cycle of not being bad enough for a high pick and not good enough to contend. The Suns should sign 1 year deals should they not get Gordon. The free agent class is a lot better next season, but the draft won’t be as good as this year’s.

  • 29 Jason A. // Jul 11, 2012 at 6:19 pm

    BTW, I just saw a report that Gerald Green is now the Pacers top FA target. What happened to Mayo? They must have given up on him because he’s coming to Phoenix.

  • 30 Kyle // Jul 11, 2012 at 6:22 pm

    I know people are Skeptical of Eric Gordon because of his injuries. But Gordon is only 23 years old and he had surgery that should prevent him from a Greg Oden type of situation, and he still has many great years left in the NBA. Some people say that the suns are better of with Oj Mayo, but gordon is younger, more talented, and has lots of potential, and I hope Gordon gets to play with the Suns, and this would be the lineup:

    Centers: Marcin Gortat, Robin Lopez (Who will resign)

    Power Forwards: Channing Frye, Markieff Morris.

    Small Forwards: Michael Beasley, Jared Dudley, Josh Childress*

    Shooting Guards: Eric Gordon, Jared Dudley*

    Point Guards: Goran Dragic, Kendall Marshall

    * Note: Jared Dudley would be swingman for SG and SF

  • 31 joey // Jul 11, 2012 at 6:25 pm

    @ andy
    It was high school ball bro. it was a showcase league for top az players. but instead of basketball , i signed with fl marlins. anyways bro beasleys deal wasn’t bad at all. market fair value. get over it.

  • 32 joey // Jul 11, 2012 at 6:27 pm

    @ andy
    It wasn’t high school ball bro. it was a showcase league for top az players. but instead of basketball , i signed with fl marlins. anyways bro beasleys deal wasn’t bad at all. market fair value. get over it.

  • 33 Andy // Jul 11, 2012 at 6:42 pm

    @ Joey – Your complete and total lack of arguments is really convincing and all…. but… I think I’ll stick with, you know, reality. Thanks, though. And thanks for taking time from your busy pro athlete schedule to post. I know with the All-Star weekend you have a few extra days and all, but shouldn’t you be prepping for the second half of the season? You’re not going to catch the Nationals if you burn all your practice time chatting us up here!

  • 34 steve // Jul 11, 2012 at 6:45 pm

    “Oh well, if you played high school ball, then BY ALL MEANS.”

    Ha, and I thought *I* was unnecessarily jerkish. Could you possibly be a little more condescending, Andy? I’m not fully convinced you think you’re better than everyone else.

  • 35 steve // Jul 11, 2012 at 6:50 pm

    Haha, every time I hit refresh, you’re making everyone feel great about themselves. Everyone here can only be thinking, cat least I’m not as big of a snob as that Andy guy.”

    Good stuff, man. Good stuff.

  • 36 joey // Jul 11, 2012 at 6:58 pm

    @ andy
    at least i played bud. the only sport you’re qualified to speak on is pocket pool. i wasn’t bragging. just letting you know that i played with and against frye so i know him a little better than you. don’t get butt hurt, or maybe you like that sort of thing, idk….just quit pretending to be knowledgable or a suns fan.

  • 37 joey // Jul 11, 2012 at 7:10 pm

    it’s funny how guys like andy take offense when someone mentions they played a little pro ball. what i can’t chat about the suns because i’m not a monday quarterback like andy? what a joke! guys like andy just drag and their negative wanna be blog bs is ridiculous. everyone knows 6mil for beasley is a fair solid deal. oh except mr andy in his moms basement with his with his muscle shirt that he won’t wear in public because he’s pail and has the body of a 12yr old with cerebral palsy. quit faking your knowledge about sports, nba, suns or anything else that involes a ball or coordination andy. we true suns fans have heard enough! joey out

  • 38 Andy // Jul 11, 2012 at 7:37 pm

    “Joey out?” Seriously.

    Wow. Just.. wow.

  • 39 Jeremiah // Jul 11, 2012 at 7:40 pm

    Beasley is definitely worth the 6 mil per year, especially considering it is only a 3 year deal which makes his contract much more tradeable if he doesn’t pan out for us.

  • 40 joey // Jul 11, 2012 at 7:44 pm

    yeah did i mention me a jim rome are buddies andy? nah but it’s a funny way to end. now go up stairs and see if mommy is done washing your undies for you. you can’t sit at your pc with tire tracks in them right andy? now go to bed already and let us men talk about our team. thanks son

  • 41 Andy // Jul 11, 2012 at 8:05 pm

    Look – I’m not denying Beasley has upside. It’s entirely possible he finds whatever Riley (historically a good drafter) saw in him and becomes a star, making that 6 million seem great. But we’re paying him rotation-player minutes, so we better hope so. His career WS/48 is .063. Plug that into last season, and he’s at the level of Lou Amundson or JJ Hickson – guys who get one year deals. Hickson, if the rumor mill is to be believed, just signed a one year, 4 million dollar deal.

    Hickson has a .074 WS/48 for his career, higher than Beasley’s .063. Hickson has a season with .123 and .101 WS/48, Beasley’s highs are .095 and .081. Hickson is only a few months older than Beasley. And Hickson doesn’t have any of the behavioral problems that Beasley has. So what, besides having once been the second pick in the draft, makes Beasley worth 2 extra years and 14 million extra dollars?

    Ryan Anderson just signed a four year deal for 32.5 million. That’s 8.5 a year. His LOWEST WS/48 for his career is .90. Other than that, he’s gone for ..161, .217, and .219. He is less than a full year older than Beasley. So, the last two years, he has more than doubled Beasley’s production.. but Beasley will be making nearly as much as him. How does that make him “fairly paid”?

    And I would love for you to explain, Joey, since I never even brought Channing Frye, how you having played against him had anything to do with whether or not Beasley is overpaid. Here’s my challenge to you – explain to me how Beasley ISN’T overpaid. His best case scenario is that he’s a volume scorer on a bad team – fortunately, we’ll probably be that. So I’m sure he’ll have plenty of opportunities to rack up points in losses. Like in Minny two years ago. But we’ll be better with him on the bench. Like Minny last year.

    As for all your internet tough guy stuff – that’s great, man. I’m really impressed. Promise.

  • 42 steve // Jul 11, 2012 at 8:12 pm

    ” As for all your internet tough guy stuff – that’s great, man. I’m really impressed. Promise.”

    Haha, you just can’t help yourself. This is amazing. Pots and kettles.

  • 43 Jason A. // Jul 11, 2012 at 8:16 pm

    I just thought I’d repost this to get us back on topic:

    When Beasley started every game he played for Min two years ago, he scored 30+ points eight times. That’s 8 of 73. He averaged 19.2 points. Sounds like a good contract to me…

  • 44 joey // Jul 11, 2012 at 8:23 pm

    my channing frye comment was about salary. Beasley is a much better player than frye and or childress and we paid them market value at the time. not many people complained about those two deals but suddenly beasley, a much more productive nba player, at 6mil is overpaid. no way that’s true. beasley has average 19ppg in a season he’s automatically our top scoring threat already without question. now we just gave dragic 4yrs 32mil with a much less impressive resume than beasley. i don’t hear you complaining about that. dragic averaged 18ppg for like 3months i like dragic but compared to beasleys deal their contracts should be reversed. the only reason i went into attack mode was i didn’t like your little backhand slide about my baseball career. i don’t think that ws stat is all that important. especially if fortson and powe are better than beasley by that stat. everyone knows beasley is way better than those 2

  • 45 Jason A. // Jul 11, 2012 at 8:27 pm

    @Andy Beasley will be our Stoudemire replacement. As a 2nd year starting PF for Miami in 09-10, he averaged 14.8 points in 29.8 minutes on 47.2% shooting. He shot 40.7% from three.

    If Dragic can repeat his performance from Houston, and odds are likely he’ll be about as good, then Beasley could be in store for a monster year. I don’t think it would be a shock to see him ave 17 and 8. I’d say that’s pretty good production from a 23 year old $6 million player with tremendous upside.

  • 46 Andy // Jul 11, 2012 at 8:33 pm

    This isn’t meant as an insult, it’s an honest question – but what was Minnesota’s record in those games? And what were Beasley’s shooting percentages? The league is full of guys who can get points inefficiently on bad teams. We could get that kind of guy cheaply. I mean, in an example near and dear to all of our hearts, Shannon Brown scored 20+ points in 5/19 games he started as a Sun. He averaged about 16 points a game in those starts. But I don’t think any of us would be ready to declare him a starting shooting guard, and we certainly wouldn’t be excied if the Suns signed him for three years, even at, say 12 million. We know he doesn’t do much else, and we know that he tended to get those numbers by jacking up a ton of shots. And in fact, Shannon Brown’s shooting stats last year (.507 TS%, .477 efg) look eerily similar to Beasley’s that 10/11 year (.510 TS%, .474 efg). And those numbers are pretty in line with what Beasley has done for his career. That, of course, is not even accounting for the fact you traditionally want your forwards to be more efficient than your volume shooting guards. There’s plenty of evidence that Beasley can finish a game with plenty of points given a lot of opportunities. But that’s not the same thing as being worth this contract. And there’s not a lot of evidence that, even when he’s at his ‘best’, he’s helping his team win.

  • 47 Jason A. // Jul 11, 2012 at 8:45 pm

    @Andy I think you’re missing my point. You ask about Min’s record but what about the Heat? Beasley is responsible for the 47 wins that season about as much as the 17 wins in Min with no talent around him. That doesn’t matter now. All I care about is how he plays for us. I think he’ll be good but we’ll find out soon enough.

  • 48 Andy // Jul 11, 2012 at 8:49 pm

    @Jason – You’ve conflated a couple stats in the above post, and I think they’re important ones. He shot .470 from the field his rookie year, but he only played 25 minutes and scored 14 a game. And his FG% has never been close to that high again – .450, .450, .445. And as you fairly point out, the pretty accurate three pointer as a weapon is a big deal for him, so the efg statistic should help him out quite a bit. (Though, that .400 rookie year was followed by a .275 for 3 sophomore slump, and he’s since settled in closer to the high .300′s. Still good, though, especially for a forward.)

    So, nothing that, in his first two seasons, he and Stat did both have eFG’s in the high .400′s. But in his third season, Stat jumped to .560. And, with the exception of the knee surgery year, was over .500 every year until this one. Beasley, meanwhile, has never been able to get as high as he was in limited minutes as a rookie (.490). That worries me. And for as much a liability as Stat could be defensively, he did at least get blocks and rebounds in his time with us. Beasley has basically no-showed those parts of the game. As far as being a scoring forward who can open the floor a bit, I get what you’re saying. Heck, I wouldn’t be surprised at all if Beasley averages more than 20 points a game this season. And even saying that, I’m skeptical the contract pays off. And I certainly don’t think he’ll make us forget our Stat. Maybe next year’s Stat.

  • 49 joey // Jul 11, 2012 at 8:58 pm

    knowone is mentioning how beasley went from pf his rookie year to small forward in Minnesota. that’s a big transition that can’t be ignored. most post players have better fg % than wing players so that has alot to do with his drop in percentage. it also hurt his rebounding as well. he went from face up from 10-15 ft on the block to being a wing slasher

  • 50 Andy // Jul 11, 2012 at 8:59 pm

    I think Wade probably had a lot more to do with the Heat’s 47 wins that year than did Beasley. Beasley actually finished 5th in win shares (admittedly not a perfect metric, but certainly not meaningless) behind Wade, Haslem, Q-Rich (who I had totally forgotten was on that team), and Jermaine O’Neal.

    I mean, look, I am a Suns fan too, even if it may not seem like it. I want him to blow up and be amazing. I really do. But I don’t think being a fan should prevent us from looking at the transaction with open eyes. It really is a big gamble, and if we are really hoping to be competitive next season, we’re counting on him being a different player next year than he has been in the past. You’re right in that we will see next year, and I will never be happier to be wrong than if he is a real star. But it’s not going to stop me from criticizing us for overspending based on the player we’ve seen on the court so far. But, hey, if nothing else, this will just mean it’s that much cooler and that much more improbable if he IS really good.

  • 51 Jason A. // Jul 11, 2012 at 9:00 pm

    @Andy, at 20 ppg the contract is considered sound, arguably a value.

  • 52 joey // Jul 11, 2012 at 9:04 pm

    can anyone in their right mind tell me how someone who scores 20ppg not worth 6mil? if beasley scores 20ppg of course he’s worth every penny. that’s what the suns need. ridiculous

  • 53 Andy // Jul 11, 2012 at 9:16 pm

    And @joey.

    1) Frye is and was overpaid. A lot of people, including myself and a writer on this very blog ( thought so at the time.
    2) As far as win shares, it’s important to note that no (at least no statistic I know of) claims to tell you who is BETTER at something. It tells you who has played better, in the past. Or at least in that specific window. The similarity score isn’t saying Beasley is worse than Powe or Fortson, it’s saying that those are players who fit his position profile who produced at similar levels to this point in their career. Now, there’s a premium to be paid for potential, but my point there is that we are paying a HUGE premium for potential given his productivity thus far. (To be clear, it DOES say Ryan Anderson has played much better, and that JJ Hickson has played better per minute, but the disparity there is big enough I’m not trying to build any huge thing out of it.)
    3) The SF/PF thing is really, really important. I think you’re probably right, he’s better as a 4. (I’ve seen other stuff saying the same thing: ) If we’re going to use him primarily as a 4, I like this deal a lot more. The problem with that, of course, is we have too many 4′s. Even if we use Frye as a backup center (and I guess let Lopez walk?), Morris, Hak, and Beasley are all competing at the 4, and we have no real 3. I’m worried we’re going to move Dudley to the 2, and Beasley to the 3. And that’s not going to help either of them.
    4) Dragic’s limited numbers absolutely make me nervous. But for what it’s worth, he pretty solidly outperforms Beasley in the same kind of per minute analysis I was using above. He’s still no Ryan Anderson, but given that we needed a point and not a 4, there’s less to quibble with there.

  • 54 Jason A. // Jul 11, 2012 at 9:18 pm

    This team could end up scoring a lot of points. I don’t think our defense will be all that great so it should be interesting to see how we do. I have to say I’m looking forward to next year.

  • 55 joey // Jul 11, 2012 at 9:20 pm

    guys andy isn’t going to cave on beasley. no matter how many points he scores. he’s the reason his team loses and when he scores 25-30 he’s not the reason his team won. beasley will be the first player in nba history who scores 20ppg and still isn’t worth his average nba salary in Andy’s mind. even though bench warmers like childress make more. 6mi is a huge value for a 20ppg scorer. the only way to get one for less is in the draft. it’s not a gamble at all to sign a 23yr old proven scorer for the price of mediocre role players. everyone should be excited we finally have a guy who can put up 20-10 since amare left.

  • 56 Andy // Jul 11, 2012 at 9:24 pm

    @both of you
    Because inefficient points scored don’t mean much, in the end. If Beasley scores 20 points a game shooting less than .475 efg at the four spot, we’re going to lose a ton of games. And maybe that’s the objective – if so, I’m actually fine with that. (And I really mean that, I think we need to blow it up and take a shot in the draft anyway, so if this is all a stealth run to do that, I approve wholeheartedly.) But, the sense I am getting from you guys is that you think Beasley can lead a playoff team in scoring. I just don’t think there’s much hope for that. If all we wanted was someone, anyone, to jack up 15+ attempts a game at bad efficiency, we could have signed any number of Shannon Brown-esque players and avoided committing a third year to the deal. But, hey, maybe if he scores a ton of points inefficiently, we can sell high on him to some team that gets stars in their eyes for PPG totals a year in a half in to speed up the rebuilding process. That, to me, is the most likely best case scenario.

  • 57 Jason A. // Jul 11, 2012 at 9:53 pm

    @Andy I wasn’t the one who said he was going to score 20 ppg, you were. I said he’s going to score 17 ppg. I think he’ll score less because he’ll stop taking the fall-away jumpers and start taking higher quality shots. On a team with Dragic, Mayo, Dudley, and Gortat there are plenty of scoring options. He’ll be able to let the game come to him and he’ll thrive. And he’ll be a huge value at $6 mil.

  • 58 Andy // Jul 11, 2012 at 10:14 pm

    If he does that, you’re absolutely right. But if he does that, he’s a different player than we’ve seen so far. What I’m saying is this – his PPG isn’t what’s going to determine whether he’s good for the team or not. It’s going to be his efg, passing, and defense that tell us whether he’s a success. But I don’t think expecting him to come in and be a 20/10 guy or a Stoudemire replacement is wise… or even a good idea for the team. (Again, unless we’re trying to lose. And that’s cool. I’m ok with that.)

  • 59 Scott // Jul 11, 2012 at 11:17 pm

    FWIW, I’m not sold on Beasley either. He’s going to have to win me over.

    I did advocate for Beasley a couple years ago. I think it was right after STAT left, and Beasley was going for $1.5m from Miami with no takers. I still think that would have been a decent move, esp. for the time. He’d have been a better, more logical experiment than Warrick, because he had the ability to spread the floor.

    Taking him now, at a MUCH higher cost … I have to wonder what changed as to why they wouldn’t take him before, but they’ll take him now.

    Is it just that Blanks is GM now, and he’s calling the shots? It could be as simple as that.

  • 60 Greg // Jul 13, 2012 at 12:50 pm

    When he was coming from the Heat he hadn’t had a season where she showed the ability to score around 20 a game…Thats what happened

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