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	<title>Comments on: Is Amare such a bad defender and rebounder?</title>
	<atom:link href="http://valleyofthesuns.com/2009/02/10/is-amare-such-a-bad-defender-and-rebounder/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://valleyofthesuns.com/2009/02/10/is-amare-such-a-bad-defender-and-rebounder/</link>
	<description>Phoenix Suns basketball blog. The hottest source in the Valley for Suns news, rumors and analysis with a fresh perspective from ESPN&#039;s TrueHoop affiliate.</description>
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		<title>By: With Nash done, Amare should be next&#124; Valley of the Suns</title>
		<link>http://valleyofthesuns.com/2009/02/10/is-amare-such-a-bad-defender-and-rebounder/comment-page-1/#comment-16528</link>
		<dc:creator>With Nash done, Amare should be next&#124; Valley of the Suns</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 23 Jul 2009 06:28:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://valleyofthesuns.com/?p=2417#comment-16528</guid>
		<description>[...] who has thoroughly improved his jumper and dribbling skills since he entered the league, and this analysis shows he&#8217;s not as bad of a defender and rebounder as you may [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] who has thoroughly improved his jumper and dribbling skills since he entered the league, and this analysis shows he&#8217;s not as bad of a defender and rebounder as you may [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Schwartz: STAT must stay&#124; Valley of the Suns</title>
		<link>http://valleyofthesuns.com/2009/02/10/is-amare-such-a-bad-defender-and-rebounder/comment-page-1/#comment-13104</link>
		<dc:creator>Schwartz: STAT must stay&#124; Valley of the Suns</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Jun 2009 07:44:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://valleyofthesuns.com/?p=2417#comment-13104</guid>
		<description>[...] rebounding and defense also might not be as bad as you think, according to this TrueHoop statistical [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] rebounding and defense also might not be as bad as you think, according to this TrueHoop statistical [...]</p>
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		<title>By: magenta</title>
		<link>http://valleyofthesuns.com/2009/02/10/is-amare-such-a-bad-defender-and-rebounder/comment-page-1/#comment-7473</link>
		<dc:creator>magenta</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 11 Feb 2009 23:42:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://valleyofthesuns.com/?p=2417#comment-7473</guid>
		<description>The issue is not with Amare. It&#039;s with us fans:  
  &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.brightsideofthesun.com/2009/2/11/757014/the-problem-s-not-with-ama&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;http://www.brightsideofthesun.com/2009/2/11/75701...&lt;/a&gt; </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The issue is not with Amare. It&#039;s with us fans: </p>
<p>  <a href="http://www.brightsideofthesun.com/2009/2/11/757014/the-problem-s-not-with-ama" rel="nofollow"></a><a href="http://www.brightsideofthesun.com/2009/2/11/75701" rel="nofollow">http://www.brightsideofthesun.com/2009/2/11/75701</a>&#8230; </p>
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		<title>By: Baguete (Sao Paulo - Brazil)</title>
		<link>http://valleyofthesuns.com/2009/02/10/is-amare-such-a-bad-defender-and-rebounder/comment-page-1/#comment-7454</link>
		<dc:creator>Baguete (Sao Paulo - Brazil)</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 11 Feb 2009 23:06:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://valleyofthesuns.com/?p=2417#comment-7454</guid>
		<description>I am not much of a stats guy, especially discussing defense, a very subtle subject like that.

The problem with his defense or rebounding is not that they are low in absolut terms, the problem is that Amare is UNDERACHIVING in these matters.

He could rebound more and he could defend better, but he doesn&#039;t, simply because of his ego or his pose. And I wouldn&#039;t pay big money for a guy who doesn&#039;t do more than one thing well on the court. If he scores a 60 ppg, that would be ok, but, of course this is not the case.

Once again: I think he&#039;s not a good defender, not a good passer, not a good rebounder, not a leader, not a clutch player and not a franchise player. He is an awesome ofensive player and a huge athlete. But doesn&#039;t matter what are your weapons if you are not willing to use them.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I am not much of a stats guy, especially discussing defense, a very subtle subject like that.</p>
<p>The problem with his defense or rebounding is not that they are low in absolut terms, the problem is that Amare is UNDERACHIVING in these matters.</p>
<p>He could rebound more and he could defend better, but he doesn&#8217;t, simply because of his ego or his pose. And I wouldn&#8217;t pay big money for a guy who doesn&#8217;t do more than one thing well on the court. If he scores a 60 ppg, that would be ok, but, of course this is not the case.</p>
<p>Once again: I think he&#8217;s not a good defender, not a good passer, not a good rebounder, not a leader, not a clutch player and not a franchise player. He is an awesome ofensive player and a huge athlete. But doesn&#8217;t matter what are your weapons if you are not willing to use them.</p>
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		<title>By: Michael Schwartz</title>
		<link>http://valleyofthesuns.com/2009/02/10/is-amare-such-a-bad-defender-and-rebounder/comment-page-1/#comment-7446</link>
		<dc:creator>Michael Schwartz</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 11 Feb 2009 21:02:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://valleyofthesuns.com/?p=2417#comment-7446</guid>
		<description>Wow, I almost don&#039;t believe that could have been offered because I can&#039;t imagine the Suns having to think for more than a second about such a deal. That&#039;s the perfect trade for Phoenix. They get a very good young power forward who makes them competitive now and is a piece you can build around for the future. You get your cap relief and don&#039;t even have to pay most of the guy&#039;s salary this year. And you get an heir apparent to Nash who&#039;s a local guy who can also boost the bench this year. If such a deal was offered, that&#039;s a no-brainer.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Wow, I almost don&#8217;t believe that could have been offered because I can&#8217;t imagine the Suns having to think for more than a second about such a deal. That&#8217;s the perfect trade for Phoenix. They get a very good young power forward who makes them competitive now and is a piece you can build around for the future. You get your cap relief and don&#8217;t even have to pay most of the guy&#8217;s salary this year. And you get an heir apparent to Nash who&#8217;s a local guy who can also boost the bench this year. If such a deal was offered, that&#8217;s a no-brainer.</p>
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		<title>By: Suns fan in Portland</title>
		<link>http://valleyofthesuns.com/2009/02/10/is-amare-such-a-bad-defender-and-rebounder/comment-page-1/#comment-7445</link>
		<dc:creator>Suns fan in Portland</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 11 Feb 2009 20:39:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://valleyofthesuns.com/?p=2417#comment-7445</guid>
		<description>Dear Steve &#039;worst GM ever&#039; Kerr and Robert &#039;cheapskate bean counter&#039; Sarver. If you are intent on trading away our best young player and trashing the Suns, please trade him to the Blazers!!! 
Not just because I&#039;m also a Blazers fan, but because I often see Lamarcus Aldridge play in person, and he&#039;s by far the best power forward I&#039;ve seen discussed in a trade for Amare. (Today CBS sports reported the Blazers offered Lamarcus and Jerred Bayles along with Lafrenzes golden ticket expiring contract.) 
Please take this trade! It&#039;s the only trade I&#039;ve seen mentioned where the Suns would get a good deal, while still saving cheapskate Sarver a bunch of money!!! You&#039;ll get an awesome young power forward and a point guard of the future!!!

As a side note, Sarver is possibly the worst owner in the NBA. Kerr may be the worst GM, but it&#039;s hard to tell, because Sarver could have been the one pushing these trades. One year ago the Suns had the best record in the league, now they&#039;re about to be in rebuilding mode while having one of the oldest rosters in the NBA. Of course the logical thing to do is trade away our best young player...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dear Steve &#8216;worst GM ever&#8217; Kerr and Robert &#8216;cheapskate bean counter&#8217; Sarver. If you are intent on trading away our best young player and trashing the Suns, please trade him to the Blazers!!!<br />
Not just because I&#8217;m also a Blazers fan, but because I often see Lamarcus Aldridge play in person, and he&#8217;s by far the best power forward I&#8217;ve seen discussed in a trade for Amare. (Today CBS sports reported the Blazers offered Lamarcus and Jerred Bayles along with Lafrenzes golden ticket expiring contract.)<br />
Please take this trade! It&#8217;s the only trade I&#8217;ve seen mentioned where the Suns would get a good deal, while still saving cheapskate Sarver a bunch of money!!! You&#8217;ll get an awesome young power forward and a point guard of the future!!!</p>
<p>As a side note, Sarver is possibly the worst owner in the NBA. Kerr may be the worst GM, but it&#8217;s hard to tell, because Sarver could have been the one pushing these trades. One year ago the Suns had the best record in the league, now they&#8217;re about to be in rebuilding mode while having one of the oldest rosters in the NBA. Of course the logical thing to do is trade away our best young player&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: inside trader</title>
		<link>http://valleyofthesuns.com/2009/02/10/is-amare-such-a-bad-defender-and-rebounder/comment-page-1/#comment-7444</link>
		<dc:creator>inside trader</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 11 Feb 2009 20:26:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://valleyofthesuns.com/?p=2417#comment-7444</guid>
		<description>i agree that amare, as a scorer,  is a very valuable asset to the suns. the team should not trade him just to make a deal. it would be a waste.

that said, the suns have to trade amare if they want a chip. it&#039;s unfortunate  no one in phoenix realized this before now, when his numbers don&#039;t make him so desirable to the rest of the league.

amare is an albatross. he is the kind of player that lights up the scoreboard and sells tickets, but he also demands a max contract and doesn&#039;t play team ball or defense.

because of his contract and his constant need to be recognized as the best player on his team, he will do more harm than good on any team he plays for.

to me, one play from a game this week sums up amare&#039;s defense and willingness to be accountable for his mistakes:

i don&#039;t remember which game it was, but amare inbounded the ball at the suns baseline, and his pass was promptly stolen by the man in front of him. instead of bodying up and blocking an easy path to the basket, he stood in one spot as the opposing player merely dribbled past him for a layup.

sure, he stuck a hand out, and that probably means something to him. he is an uncoachable prima donna who will never, ever, bring his team a ring.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>i agree that amare, as a scorer,  is a very valuable asset to the suns. the team should not trade him just to make a deal. it would be a waste.</p>
<p>that said, the suns have to trade amare if they want a chip. it&#8217;s unfortunate  no one in phoenix realized this before now, when his numbers don&#8217;t make him so desirable to the rest of the league.</p>
<p>amare is an albatross. he is the kind of player that lights up the scoreboard and sells tickets, but he also demands a max contract and doesn&#8217;t play team ball or defense.</p>
<p>because of his contract and his constant need to be recognized as the best player on his team, he will do more harm than good on any team he plays for.</p>
<p>to me, one play from a game this week sums up amare&#8217;s defense and willingness to be accountable for his mistakes:</p>
<p>i don&#8217;t remember which game it was, but amare inbounded the ball at the suns baseline, and his pass was promptly stolen by the man in front of him. instead of bodying up and blocking an easy path to the basket, he stood in one spot as the opposing player merely dribbled past him for a layup.</p>
<p>sure, he stuck a hand out, and that probably means something to him. he is an uncoachable prima donna who will never, ever, bring his team a ring.</p>
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		<title>By: merl</title>
		<link>http://valleyofthesuns.com/2009/02/10/is-amare-such-a-bad-defender-and-rebounder/comment-page-1/#comment-7442</link>
		<dc:creator>merl</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 11 Feb 2009 19:27:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://valleyofthesuns.com/?p=2417#comment-7442</guid>
		<description>07-08: +6.4
06-07: +0.6
05-06: Injury
04-05: +8.9

Michael, those plus minus fugures are affected by the quality of the player that comes in for him.  

In 07 Boris Diaw was the &#039;third&#039; big (if you consider the Marion/Shaq tandem to occupy one position)
In 06 Kurt Thomas was the third guy (and Diaw 4th)
In 05 it doesn&#039;t matter, cause he was injured
In 04 they had Stephen Hunter as the third big man.

So the &#039;abberation&#039; of Amare&#039;s plus-minus being so flat in 06/06 is I think a sign that Kurt Thomas was a much higher quality player than they have had in other seasons, so that the big-man dropoff isn&#039;t so steep when Amare goes to the bench.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>07-08: +6.4<br />
06-07: +0.6<br />
05-06: Injury<br />
04-05: +8.9</p>
<p>Michael, those plus minus fugures are affected by the quality of the player that comes in for him.  </p>
<p>In 07 Boris Diaw was the &#8216;third&#8217; big (if you consider the Marion/Shaq tandem to occupy one position)<br />
In 06 Kurt Thomas was the third guy (and Diaw 4th)<br />
In 05 it doesn&#8217;t matter, cause he was injured<br />
In 04 they had Stephen Hunter as the third big man.</p>
<p>So the &#8216;abberation&#8217; of Amare&#8217;s plus-minus being so flat in 06/06 is I think a sign that Kurt Thomas was a much higher quality player than they have had in other seasons, so that the big-man dropoff isn&#8217;t so steep when Amare goes to the bench.</p>
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		<title>By: Jordan</title>
		<link>http://valleyofthesuns.com/2009/02/10/is-amare-such-a-bad-defender-and-rebounder/comment-page-1/#comment-7441</link>
		<dc:creator>Jordan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 11 Feb 2009 18:42:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://valleyofthesuns.com/?p=2417#comment-7441</guid>
		<description>Interesting stuff, and your last line is definitely sage  advice, but looking at your numbers from a different perspective, how many elite power forwards/centers has Amare guarded this year? For that matter, how many elite power forwards/centers are there in the league? Not many on both accounts. That needs to be taken into account. I haven&#039;t followed too many Suns games this year (not fun stuff to watch at all anymore) but last season, Amare was getting pummeled by any and every power forward/Center he faced. He gave up 40 or something to Jefferson. Even Erick Dampier took him to school. And, rebounding totals don&#039;t really mean too much when you&#039;re getting 35-40 minutes a night. It&#039;s rebound rate that matters, and Amare, as noted by Sam Cohen, is HORRIBLE.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Interesting stuff, and your last line is definitely sage  advice, but looking at your numbers from a different perspective, how many elite power forwards/centers has Amare guarded this year? For that matter, how many elite power forwards/centers are there in the league? Not many on both accounts. That needs to be taken into account. I haven&#8217;t followed too many Suns games this year (not fun stuff to watch at all anymore) but last season, Amare was getting pummeled by any and every power forward/Center he faced. He gave up 40 or something to Jefferson. Even Erick Dampier took him to school. And, rebounding totals don&#8217;t really mean too much when you&#8217;re getting 35-40 minutes a night. It&#8217;s rebound rate that matters, and Amare, as noted by Sam Cohen, is HORRIBLE.</p>
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		<title>By: Michael Schwartz</title>
		<link>http://valleyofthesuns.com/2009/02/10/is-amare-such-a-bad-defender-and-rebounder/comment-page-1/#comment-7440</link>
		<dc:creator>Michael Schwartz</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 11 Feb 2009 18:38:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://valleyofthesuns.com/?p=2417#comment-7440</guid>
		<description>Agreed, but to discuss something like that you need to look at more data. Here&#039;s the Suns plus-minus when Amare is on/off the court the last couple years:
07-08: +6.4
06-07: +0.6
05-06: Injury
04-05: +8.9
I&#039;m not a math major, but those numbers make no sense. Every other year the difference between Amare being on the floor or not makes a huge difference and on the off year it&#039;s almost negligible. Very weird that those stats would hold up for a whole season.  That makes it hard to quantify how much better the Suns are when Amare is out there.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Agreed, but to discuss something like that you need to look at more data. Here&#8217;s the Suns plus-minus when Amare is on/off the court the last couple years:<br />
07-08: +6.4<br />
06-07: +0.6<br />
05-06: Injury<br />
04-05: +8.9<br />
I&#8217;m not a math major, but those numbers make no sense. Every other year the difference between Amare being on the floor or not makes a huge difference and on the off year it&#8217;s almost negligible. Very weird that those stats would hold up for a whole season.  That makes it hard to quantify how much better the Suns are when Amare is out there.</p>
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